Goldilocks and the three contracts
Derek Jeter isnt as good as he used to be?
Fine.
But…
Lets compare numbers:
Player A: 179 H, 111 R, 30 2B, 10 HR, 63 BB, 106 SO
Player B: 184 H, 110R, 30 2B, 19 HR, 46 BB, 104 SO
Player C: 164 H, 106 R, 46 2B, 27 HR, 82 BB, 147 SO
…One of those 3 is Mr Jeter. The others are the other 2 big name/contract singings of the offseason, Werth and Crawford. All of em are seemingly on par with one another, except Werth has more power-but more Ks, Jeter has less powerbut is on base more, and Crawford is right in between-not too special in comparison.
So, yeah, equals…
One of them was signed to a big contract and it was seen as a joke
One of them was signed to a big contract and it was seen as excessive
One of them was signed to a big contract and it was seen as a good move
How is that possible? Unless you factor in bias towards teams signing the players.
I love how the Nationals just threw all that money at one player. It proves that no one is holding a gun to the other 28 teams and saying “Only the Yankees/Red sox are allowed to spend that much money”
It also proves that just because youre one of the biggest free agents out there, then your choices are immediatly limited to just two or three cities
The Nationals are building a contender here. Take some homegrown talent, add in a couple well scouted signings and finish it off with one or two big name free agents? Reminds me of 1996.
So what Im really trying to ask here is : Why are people mocking the Nationals for this?
Could it be that theres another team out there besides the obvious two that is actually *gasp* willing to spend money on their team so they can win?!?! Who knows? Maybe theyll shock everything and pull several hundred millions out of nowhere for Cliff Lee. Can you imagine the 2012 Nationals rotation being led by Strasburg and Lee? With Jason Werth and god knows who else in the lineup?
I know I ran a bit off with that, so lemme wrap it up here:
Jeter signs with NYY: Ho-hum, nothing new or interesting.
Crawford signs with BOS: Not bad, but they aint winning the division on that alone.
Werth signs with DC: No major impact right now, but down the line, could be huge.
….and oh yeah, Boston also aquired Adrien Gonzalez for what I believe to be their entire farm system. This is awesome because they are officially FUCCKED after 2012 when a bunch of their high profile players start hitting free agency and theyll have little to no money to work with…hell, their in trouble right now because they have no farm system to address any other needs they have, let alone any injuries next year.
That reminds me a lot of the Mets right now. All these big names, 0 farm team, 0 chance.
Yankee Hater Hater
I would suggest that if you are going to comment on another team (or anytime really), you check your facts a little bit. The Red Sox gave up 3 prospects and a utility player (Patterson) for Adrian Gonzalez, their top pitching prospect Casey Kelly is a loss, their top position prospect Anthony Rizzo is less of a loss considering he is a 1B which happens to be Gonzalez’ position, and a young OF prospect Reymond Fuentes who is still a couple of years from even becoming a top prospect at this point. No system can lose it’s two top prospects and say it is as good as it was before, but the Sox system still has plenty of depth, enough that when Drew becomes a FA after the season, his replacement (Kalish) is waiting in AAA for his shot, and when Matsuzaka finally exits there will be several top arms hoping to take the #5 starter spot (including Ranaudo, Doubront, Britton, and Tazawa). With regards to the Sox being screwed when all of their high profile players hit free agency after 2012, they already Kalish as Drew’s replacement, and Daniel Bard/Bobby Jenks as Papelbon’s, and other than David Ortiz, the rest of the team is under club control through at least 2014.
As for your Crawford/Werth/Jeter comparison, all you looked at was offensive statistics from last year in determining these players value, however Crawford is a dynamic outfielder, who has just entered his prime, plays exceptional defense, and a five tool player (the type of player you pay a premium for). Werth is a power hitter/run producer who is at the tail end of his prime, plays strong defense, and is a guy to build a lineup around (he is overpaid with this contract yes, but Washington had to pay a premium in order to get a player of his ability to play for the Nats). Jeter is a productive catalyst at the top of the Yankees order, he is a tough out, and plays the game with some of the best instincts around, however he is also well past his prime entering the twilight of his career, his defensive skills have eroded to the point that he is a defensive liability (despite his reputation based Gold Gloves), and his biggest value to the Yankees is almost certainly what he has done for them in the past, and not what he will do for them in the future. I think the Yankees were right to extend Jeter and Rivera, they deserved that respect, however unlike Rivera who should play up to his contract, Jeter will have a tough time producing at a level close to what he will be paid.
The Red Sox farm system is one of the most overrated group in all of minor league baseball. And Im not just saying that, most experts outside of Boston fandom would agree that the rankings of Boston players are much higher than they deserve.
Then again, my “Boston is Fuccked” comment centered more around how they have no money left after this. Not saying that they cant spend more money if they wanted to (I encourage it) but at this point if they spend any more money, they might actually surpass the Yankees, which might throw the universe out of order.
…BTW, correct me if Im wrong, but isnt Casey Kelly (ya know, that top pitching prospect Boston traded) a failed shortstop in the minors? The Red Sox prospects traded to SD were all good, but nowhere near great-and they were the best the team had on the farm. Boston comitted robbery with that deal.
Also
-
Im still baffled at how Jeter is a “terrible” shortstop. Im sure its just people with their panties in a twist over the gold glove (the award was a farce over a decade before).
Jeter: .989 fielding% (Highest among all SS) vs just 6 errors (Just for comparisons sake, the 2 popular choices over Jeter were Alexi Ramirez and Elvis Andrus….Ramirez: .974, 20 errors…Andrus: .976, 16 errors) So maybe the alternatives were flashy and exciting to watch, but Jeter got the job done defensively. Period. Thats all you should ask for of a defender.
-YHH
Kelly was a two way star in HS, was considered a good shortstop prospect, and elite pitching prospect when drafted, the Sox agreed to let him split time at Pitcher and SS in his first year, but convinced him that his best option was to pitch after that. They aggresively promoted him as a pitcher, 20 year old in AA last year as he was not challenged in the lower levels, he had some struggles, but concensus all over baseball was that he was at least a #2 MLB starting pitcher in the not too distant future, most experts agree that he instantly became San Diego’s top prospect when the trade was completed, and that Rizzo was easily #2, and Fuentes definitely in the top 5.
You may want to study up a little, it’s called UZR (Ultimate Zone Rating), and it is recognized as one of the top defensive metrics available. Jeter’s UZR for 2010 was -4.7, compared to other American League SS with at least 450 innings, Jeter ranks 13 out of 16. If you want to go the “most experts” route which is how you seem to base your arguments, most experts agree that Jeter is a well below average defensive SS, and has been for a number of years now, he has had 1 above average UZR in the last 8 years.
The Red Sox farm system has consistently ranked as one of the top minor league systems since the new owners came in. The only thing that needs to be said with regards to the Sox farm system being overrated is to mention the following names: Daniel Bard, Clay Buccholz, Jacoby Ellsbury, Dustin Pedroia, Jon Lester, Jonathen Papelbon, Hanley Ramirez, Kevin Youkilis all developed in the Sox farm system in recent years, and those are just the elite guys, there are plenty of others both on the Red Sox and on other teams (used in trades), and there are plenty of future big leaguers in the current system, though a lot of the close to MLB ready talent was used to acquire Gonzalez. If the Sox offer for A. Gonzalez sucked so bad why didn’t another team make a better offer, why not the Yankees? Surely the Yankees #1 guy (Montero) could have got it done, oh that’s right they have offered him for Soria, and Cliff Lee, and Halladay over the past couple of years, I guess maybe he is a little overrated. In all fairness, the Yankees system is stronger than the Red Sox system right now, thye have more prospects closer to the majors than the Sox, but the Sox system is deep (which is what I said in my original response), lots of top young talent down in the lower levels A ball and below, and the Sox will have accumulated 6 of the top 70 or so picks in the 2011 amateur draft (which is said to be the top draft talent wise in quite a few years. The Sox system will be a top 10 system again by next year, and pushing top 5 in 2 years.
Lastly, the Sox are no where near the Yankees in payroll, not even close, they have not been within $45 million in any of the past 7 years, since the Yankees stopped caring about having any kind of budget. The Red Sox will have approximately $45 M coming off the books after the 2011 season, more than enough to accomadate signing Gonzalez, filling a couple of spots on the roster, no $$$ issues for the Red Sox for the at least the next 3 or 4 years.
I’m pretty sure most teams could send SD a prospect and he’ll instantly become the teams number 1. Thats like if Joe Morgan replaced Tim McCarver on Fox games-its a pretty sh!tty upgrade, but its an upgrade nevertheless.
Who the hell isnt a 2 way baseball player in high school? At that level, everybody played the field-it was a bonus if you could pitch as well. Pretty stupid on Bostons part to let him attempt both SS and pitching, unless he isnt as awesome at either, but I guess we’ll see in San Diego.
And on Jeter-he’s either the best or the worst depending on what stat you look at. Either way it wont change a thing-cuz Jeter still has the 2010 gold glove, and the world hasnt ended because of it-so I guess he deserves it.
And dont twist my words-I couldnt care less about you all-time-BoSox-farm-system players. It doesnt change the fact that the Red Sox farm system is still CURRENTLY the most overrated thing in MiLB. Both before and especially after the SD trade.
Why didnt he Yankees offer up for Gonzalez? Gee, I dunno….oh yeah, we already had the best 1B in baseball not named Pujols. We let you have Gonzalez seeing how we snuck in and took Teixeira from you a couple years ago. Enjoy your consolation prize.
-Montero easily outshines every Red Sox prospect-to the point where the Yankees actually hesitate on trading him. And when we did try and deal him, teams would hold out to rape our farm team further-except Seattle who only talked to the Yankees to scare Texas into trading them more prospects.
-YHH
Nationals fan here. Let me get this out of the way first. Jayson Werth was way overpaid without any doubts.
Now onto your comparison of three players. You missed two important things, age and speed. Other two are 28 and 31 respectively. Jeter is not getting any faster on basepaths when he is on the wrong side of 30′s. So yes, Jeter will be paid $17 million as 39 years old SS. logical?
I am not Boston fan but at least Red Sox seems better off in near future than the Yankees who lost on pretty much all their FA targets. Theo was smart that he has beefed up the offense with two players who could perform well in Fenway Park. Besides, you may expect better seasons from Beckett, Lackey, and co than the past season. I may not agree with people who are penciling in Boston as AL pennant winner, but it is hard to argue against their case.
Back to FA signings, all are overpaid. To be honest, it is hard to find one FA that is not overpaid, Werth a little more than others.
YHH – you see the world through pinstripe colored glasses my friend. Are you talking about the same Mark Teixeira who hit .256/.365/.481 last year, not even in the same conversation as Pujols .312/.414/.596, but he isn’t favorably comparable to other elite (or non elite) MLB 1st baseman either Votto .324/.424/.600, Cabrera .328/.420/.622, Morneau .345/.437/.618, Konerko .312/.393/.584 even Youkilis .307/.411/.564, and A.Gonzalez (the guy the Yanks let us have?) .298/.393/.511 in the worst hitters park in baseball. Even Aubrey Huff hit .290/.385/.506, now maybe Teixeira will bounce back with a better 2011 season, but don’t call someone with an OPS almost 50 points lower than Aubrey Huff the 2nd best 1B in baseball, that is just ridiculous.
Yes, a lot of players are two-way players in HS, not too many of them are considered 1st round talents at both SS and pitcher however. Kelly was also considered the future QB at Tennesee until the Sox signed him, and though you will blindly say he isn’t a prospect, any scout out there will tell you he has the upside of an ace, and the downside of a #2 starter, which makes him a pretty legit prospect. Kelly preferred being an everyday player vs pitching, the Sox had him split his first season 1st half pitch, 2nd half SS, and he was extremely successful as a pitcher and chose to focus on pitching after that.
I am not going to say something stupid about Montero, the truth is that his bat is special, but he won’t be a MLB caliber catcher defensively, so he may wind up at DH if he remains a Yankee. The fact remains, Seattle preferred Smoak to Montero, and the Royals wouldn’t trade Soria for Montero, which I do not understand why the Yankees would even offer, quite frankly.
Finally, what makes it a FACT that the Sox farm system is the most overrated in baseball? Because you said so, you also said Teixeira was the best 1B not named Pujols, so we know how that goes (Pinstriped Colored Glasses). Fact is that the Sox farm system is a middle tier ranked system right now, but with very strong depth in the lower minors, and likely to take a big jump after this year. I didn’t list an all-time-bosox farm team, I simply rattled off the All-Star caliber players the Sox have developed in the past 5-6 years, it was a quality list. I can do the same for the Yankees farm system, Cano, Hughes (I might be missing a player or 2, Gardner is close, but please don’t cry for Joba, he is about a season away from being a bust).